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23 May 2007

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Johnny Laird

Hi Paul

...just stumbled into your blog after googling "Luke Bretherton". I'm not a stalker(! ;-), but I'd heard Luke speak this week, so was interested to do some detective work on his work. Your blog looks interesting, so I guess I'll be passing by often.

Peace & Blessings

J

David

Hey Paul,
Good summation of a conversation that really has no definition. :-)

I would say that althought there a similarities with emergent to other movements in the past (pentecostalism, holiness, etc), there are differences.

The major one being that emergent is in response to post-modern culture and thought so it's influence is farther reaching, becuase it's in response to a new era of Western Civilization, not just within Christian culture.

Also, where other movements in the past centered more on theology, this centers more on practice of theology.

But that's a pretty broad brush stroke. :-)

Paul

Thanks Jonny feel free to stop by anytime. I've only read Luke's chapter in the book but he sounds like a top bloke. What was the talk about?

Paul

Thanks David - i'm not sure it is a particularly comprehensive summary but more a stable of my emerging church hobby horses :)

You are right there are a number of similarities and of course in practice there will be differences at the micro level - we might sound different and look different but at the marco level I would argue are differences are small.

You highlight this by pointing out the emerging church is a movement that it is in reaction to post-modernity, which i agree with you it is. In the same way the new church movt, the charismatic movt and even pente are movts in reaction too - as reactionary/revolutionary movements we have a lot in common.

The question which my next post explores is ok what happens when the reaction is over - when post-modernity is embraced by most in the west and is a no brainer. Does that mean the emerging church is then emerged - no longer on the exciting transition of experiential faith but maturing? how do you sustain reactionary movements in the long term? how can we grow older gracefully? For one day we will hopefully be an old church...

Johnny Laird

Hi again Paul,

Luke was speaking on "Hospitality as Holiness", which is also the title of another book he's written.

He was a guest speaker at a Salvation Army event I attend called "The Supper Club*". At some point they will post the content of Luke's presentation at a site called TheRubicon(http://www.therubicon.org)

*The Rubicon rather grandly describes The Supper Club as "...an eclectic group of thinking individuals who are either active Salvation Army members or with some connection and/or history with the movement. “Contemplative activists”, might be a good description of the group." I have trouble resonating with that description, but it's a good bunch of folks, who like to think, chat, meet & eat!

J :-)

David

Good insight. Yeah, even Tony Jones, says that someday emergent will be something people will consider old and outdated.

Hopefully, this conversation (as emergent leaders put it) will progress forward and not get stagnant and rigid; boxed up, like God Moves in the past.

Hopefully emergents response to post-modernity will allow the church to see through new eyes the wonders of God that propels us forward and not keeps us stuck in our 'old emerging ways'.

Only time will tell I suppose...

Paul

thanks Jonny - folk who like to meet, chat and eat I can always resonate with :)

Paul

thanks David, that tony jones is a wise fellow, a bit like you clearly :)

Yes one day we will grow old and the next new thang will be here - which is why i find deep church exciting in helping us mature and connect both with the 'new spirit inspired' past and future in the here and now :)

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